S14 FMIC - The verdict

Thanks everybody, will give them a call. 😉

Phinx wrote:

The turbo is Very, Very close to the flow rates and power outputs of a GT28R, just without the ball-bearing cart.
You will be able to easily push 150Rwkw on that turbo without much work. I'm also not a fan on Uni-chips, piggyback , xms what ever. There is a possibility this could also be your issue maybe a bikiROM is a better route but I don't think this is your issue.

But lets cover the basics before another tuner touch's your car again.
Hows the Compression on you motor?
How do the plugs look?
Base timing?
Could there be a boost leak?
Could the stock BOV be leaking?
Any shaft play on the turbo?

Also not a piggy back fan, but for what I intended, plenty good.
Motor has done about 40 000km since a complete as new rebuild. Uses no oil etc.
New plugs
Will check what is is set to later when I connect the consult.
Maus should have picked that if if any, reported and/or fixed it.
BOV is fine, slightly modified.
Turbo fine

johansx wrote:

Hennie Marais wrote:

but like I said, many other factor does affect it, like a restrictive stock intercooler, exhaust system, boost pipes, etc.

The whole idea of this excercise was to remove restrictions, namely the AFM, throttle body and inlet piping. IC is 3 times bigger etc. So flow should be way better. Air box on the inlet and down pipe on the exhaust the only room for improvement.

That's excatly what I mean by other factors, if the old ones were a restrictionto the turbo, it would have improved the flow to the engine by changing them, but that's if they restricted the max flow of the turbo, but if the stock ones could flow the max the turbo can, then they were not a restriction, then it means the turbo couldn't supply enough air for the engine, so by upgrading it you will not realise better flow, maybe better efficiency by cooling the air more. See what I mean. But if that is the case then by upgrading the turbo now, will give way better results by being able to supply the air needed by the engine.

The closest to the stock T28 turbo is the GT2854 which has a max flow of +-27lbs = 270hp = 202kw at the flywheel = 150rwkw with 25%loss. so you're max of the turbo is 150rwkw.

Hennie Marais wrote:

The closest to the stock T28 turbo is the GT2854 which has a max flow of +-27lbs = 270hp = 202kw at the flywheel = 150rwkw with 25%loss. so you're max of the turbo is 150rwkw.

Spot on. So where did the missing 25 rwkw go? If at least to got to like 140+, yes, they tried, but 125 is not realistic.

do they use a ambient correction on their dyno printout.

Damn it , Hennie Marais ...

You just have to much knowledge.... 😂 😂 😂 😂 😂

Hennie Marais wrote:

do they use a ambient correction on their dyno printout.

Maus is a high profile tuner, doing work for Nissan Motorsport etc. Their dyno should be the best, reliable etc. etc.... It was raining the morning during the dyno. Doubt that the ambient correction will affect more than a few %. Even at 5%, we are talking like 6-7 kw. If it was 140kw plus, I would have been happy. The car also feels the same as before (Unichip+xhaurts) on my butt dyno.

Dastek had a go at it when I fitted the X-Force stainless branch, they said it produced 163 rwkw, but I could never get the dyno graph out of them. The car was in fact way slower, specially at top end.

The only crowd that impressed me so far was Bonus spars. The 1st AFM was a dud. The second run out of steam on half throttle. When I returned it, they phoned around to help me, got a discount so that I did not need to pay anything extra for a brand new Z33 AFM :!:
Way to go guys. 😉

Johan, fit a boost controller and up the boost. Serious - just that. 8)

Answer I got from the other SX forum I frequent....😮

Front mount and piping seem a little small - and wondering why you "flowed" the head? SRs flow quite well up to around 500 flywheel. Also wondering why you didnt do anything with the turbo? Or Injectors?
That will be your limiting factor around 200rwkw is the most you could reliably get.
Regards,
Jeff Ash
Managing Director - C-Red Tuning - www.c-red.com.au

and when I told him about the +6rwkw...

*cough*
Its a bit soft in the power stakes, 6rwkw is barely 15hp at the flywheel. For your money you'd be expecting a lot more.
Regards,
Jeff Ash
Managing Director - C-Red Tuning

why you didnt do anything with the turbo?

🙄

Cool Chem 8)

johansx wrote:

Hennie Marais wrote:

do they use a ambient correction on their dyno printout.

Maus is a high profile tuner, doing work for Nissan Motorsport etc. Their dyno should be the best, reliable etc. etc.... It was raining the morning during the dyno. Doubt that the ambient correction will affect more than a few %. Even at 5%, we are talking like 6-7 kw. If it was 140kw plus, I would have been happy. The car also feels the same as before (Unichip+xhaurts) on my butt dyno.

Way to go guys. 😉

I know they are, but you are comparing it to calibrators tune's and he uses a correction factor, I just want to compare the 2, theirs might be way lower that his, go check the graphs he posted earlier in the year.

Another answer form a guy running a high power S15.

My theory is that with a good 3" exhaust and decent chip tuning (even
though the s14 ECU is inferior to the s15's) you should be talking
around 140kW to the wheels or more. Slightly more if you have an intake
upgrade. Something sounds wrong with a 119kW power output... Does the
exhaust go right up to the turbo, or is it a cat back exhaust. On turbo
cars, get the exhaust wrong, then it doesn't matter what else you do to
the car...

On my s15 my first mod was a CES turbo-back system. They claim a 44kW
increase just by fitting the exhaust... My seat-of-the-pants kinda
confirms that, from my test drive immediately after I fitted the exhaust
system. With 1 Bar boost, K&N filter, FMIC with 2.5" in and out and
Chiptorque chip tuning the car got >180kW to the wheels - the MAF and
the injectors are maxed out according to my tuner.

the 200kW limit Jeff talks about is a ballpark figure depending on the
specific car (differences in drive train losses, etc) and the
differences in dyno and dyno operator. You can get more power to the
wheels (but not more engine power output) by reducing losses such as
lightening flywheel and pulleys, removing wyndage losses, etc etc - but
these are not cheap options.

Flowing the head by extrude honing or similar is a good idea, but isn't
really a factor unless you've done everything else...

The FMIC pipe sizes look about right for a non-drag-car, as throttle
response will be retained... The in-pipe may be slightly small, but
will be better than stock...

The throttle body will make just about zero difference, unless your
flow is huge, and without going massive boost that won't be a factor
IMHO.

So to try to answer your questions...

Q: What is the maximum power achievable with this setup, up from the
119 rwkw upgrade?

A: To quantify this, I need to qualify my answer. You should be able
to get around 180kW (conservative) to the wheels with decent FMIC,
exhaust, chiptuning with increased boost. I note you have no
aftermarket boost controller listed in your mods, so you are probably
running near stock boost (with those mods that's probably around 0.6-0.7
Bar)

Q: What is the max and reliable boost the std turbo can handle?

A: Don't go beyond 0.8 Bar without tuning, or 1.0 Bar with tuning
(reliability is the key word in that question)

Q: What is the next thing I can do to get the biggest bang for the
buck?

A: Boost controller - say a GFB Atomic... That's what I use...

I hope this helps.

MikeG.

I agree there is something up...

Look I know you really cant compare but I did 140 rwkw with an exhaust, turbo upgrade (see garage) exhaust manifold , IC , boost controller and 0,5 bar boost and I'm a 1.8.

: Boost controller - say a GFB Atomic... That's what I use...

There you are. I also said that 😛

The throttle body will make just about zero difference, unless your
flow is huge, and without going massive boost that won't be a factor

And I basically said that as well.

Chem 8)

ChemCool wrote:

The throttle body will make just about zero difference, unless your
flow is huge, and without going massive boost that won't be a factor

And I basically said that as well.

Chem 8)

Remember the plan... step by step.... get the basics right, so when you finally add the mother of all turbos etc etc.... you can run reliable... So the throttle body is all in the big scheme of things. Nothing is over done at this stage. In the end it must still be a drivable reliable car as it is now.

Spend an hour or 2 today going over everything. Checking pipes for possible leaks etc. Still looking for a tuner... Maybe phone Dastek on Monday to get a list of their capable dealers :idea: :?:

list of their capable dealers

This will be handy. So we can know who can handle the unichip

Hooked up a small spring to the wastegate.....boost is now .75 bar max. My but dyno says ....... Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeehaaaaaaaaaaa :!: :!: :!:

ps maybe it is time for a boost controller 😉

From the http://www.dastek.co.za website...

It basically alters crank and load signals. The latest level can do boost control, water injection, nitrious injection with extra maps which are activated only once the water or nitrious becomes active. It can cut the nitrious at specified Rpm point as well as map the amount of water or nitrious versus RPM. It records the maximum RPM and boost for engine guarantee purposes and many other things. It can do launch control, drive extra injectors, accel enrichment, drive manifold flaps or cam solenoids and has many other functions.

My "other" contact says to use these guys in vd Hoff rd. :

Toyota Bakkie spares Pretoria west 012 3798790

Anybody heard of them? Apparently not everybody can tune the new Unichips.